conversations in ten questions 81: Katsumi Sakakura

We interviewed with Katsumi Sakakura, the creator of the show The Life of HOKUSAI, which will be the guest of the 6th Istanbul Fringe Festival, which will be held between 13-21 September 2024 this year. It will be staged at ENKA Auditorium on 17 September 2024 in collaboration with ENKA Arts and Istanbul Fringe Festival 2024 on the occasion of the 100th anniversary of the establishment of diplomatic relations between Japan and Turkey. The show's creator, Katsumi Sakakura (1963), himself a composer, director, choreographer and actor, is, as you might expect, a multi-talented artist. Sakakura, who started karate at the age of five and boxing at university, has created a performance art called Geibu, based on the unique "movement, rhythm and spirituality" of the traditional Japanese martial art Budo. He also created Street Nunchaku by combining Nunchaku, a defensive art he learnt alongside karate, with the hip hop dance moves he began performing in his twenties. He then developed Projection Live, which he describes as a new style of performance that synchronises live dance and projected images. Sakakura has performed his shows in 43 countries and appeared on television in 22 countries using this style, which has received great acclaim around the world. Sakakura, who designs her own clothes, costumes and accessories for both stage and everyday use, was inspired by a famous American choreographer's question, "Why are you copying foreign styles when there are so many cool elements in Japanese art and culture?" and dedicated herself to pursuing the concept of Japanese cool. To this end, for many years Sakakura has been giving lectures in Japan and abroad (University of Bologna, University of Tokyo, Moscow State University and SOAS University of London, etc.) on Cool Japan, which is worth sharing with the world. Now it is time to get to know Katsumi Sakakura, who has aroused our interest and curiosity with his unusual CV, better by answering the questions we have put to him.

What do you think is the essence of performance? 

To me "Performance" means just being there in the moment, with my own true feelings. It's not dancing, it's not acting, it's only recognizing the "present". Whenever I perform or create a performance of art myself, I always have one thought. The most important thing to me at that time is "I only do what I want to do". I might think about the outcome before I perform, although it does not necessary turn out that way. I believe in my own rules and choose only what I want to do in the moment. In my case, that's the essence. 

Do you believe in the transformative power of art? In what way? 

Yes, I believe that art has the power to change nowaday problems for the better. The reason is simple:I myself was saved by art. I underwent a major transformation through the power of art. When I was a kid, I felt I was totally useless. Art has changed me greatly, and I am now enjoying life to the fullest. There are people whose lives have improved after watching my expressions, performances, and way of life. However, I think I simply served as a catalyst to help them realize that they are happy enough just the way they are. I simply create an opportunity. Those who take it, also have to dig deep within themselves and make the discovery. I think that self discovery is a form of art. My thought is that "Only those who really desire change can realize that they actually have the ability to transform themselves." 

When you are working on a piece, what sources inspire you? Do dreams play a role in your work? 

Regarding inspiration for creating a performance, I don't get inspiration from outside myself. When I was younger, in my twenties, I was a huge fan of Hip-Hop culture. All I did was watch MTV every week and copy the latest dance moves and steps at that time. When I created something by copying and pasting other people's creative work, I proudly said: "Look, this is the art of work I created!" It is quite embarrassing when I look back at it now. When I realized that was not the way, I decided to stop mimicking others' performances and started digging deep into myself. It's what I find there that inspires my work. The best thing about this method is that if the work I create turns out to be good, I can proudly say that it came entirely from within me and is not a copy of someone else's. Many people give me advice. They tell me, "Watch as many performances as you can, from classical to contemporary styles." However, doing that is the same as adding various other soups to my soup. Each of the various soups is certainly delicious, but mixing them together little by little causes two bad things for me. One is that even if an individual soup is delicious, it becomes less delicious when mixed together. And the other is that my own flavor gradually disappears. Someone who can add each soup in a balanced way by selectively choosing and discarding will be able to create an even more delicious soup, but I am not skilled enough to incorporate elements from other soups in a balanced way. In that case, I think it would be better not to add other soups from the beginning in order to create a delicious soup that is unique to me. But this method takes time. That's why I was finally recognized by the world when I was over 50 years old. 

When do you decide to give a piece you are working on a title if it does not already have one? 

I'm a performing artist, but I also create other three-dimensional objects. These include ornaments, wearable pieces, and paintings. In fact, many of the works I've created don't have titles. Maybe it's because I don't think titles are that important for me. I often give them titles out of necessity. For example, if I'm going to communicate my work to the outside world, I'll give it a title because I have to use the work's name. To answer your question correctly, when do I give a title to my work, it's when I feel the need to share my work with the outside world only. 

Is there an artist or person who you think has influenced your art the most? And if so, who? 

Unfortunately, I don't have anyone. I didn't go to art school, and I didn't study under anyone. Moreover, I was diving deep inside myself, so I couldn't be influenced by anyone. Certainly, deep down in my own heart, there were things that had sunk into my mind that affected me. They were the Japanese old movie "Zatoichi" (played by Shintaro Katsu) and the Japanese anime "Ghost in the Shell." They were planted like seeds in my body before I knew who I was yet. Those seeds sprouted and blossomed when I started my creative work. Now, I believe they are about to bear fruit. 

Considering the current state of the world in every sense, what is the most important and urgent issue for you as an artist? 

It is to contribute to world peace. I have expressed the coolness and splendor of Japan. What I discovered in this activity is that Japanese spirituality is unique in the world. Now, I believe that Japanese spirituality can help people's mental health and leads them to a peaceful state of mind. I think that the peace in one's person heart and world peace are direct connected. I believe that Japanese spirituality can contribute to world peace. In particular,I find the message I want to deliver in the "spirit of compassion [SOKUIN] " sought after by the samurai. That's why I give lectures about Japanese culture "SOKUIN" all over the world. It will probably take something like 100 years before the world changes as a result of this. Even acknowledging that it will take a long time, I can't stop. It's urgent issue for me as an artist. 

We know that you were inspired by a simple question from a famous American choreographer - "Why do you copy foreign styles when there are so many cool elements in Japanese art and culture?" - and have since devoted yourself to pursuing the concept of Cool Japan. Could you briefly explain to us what "Japanese COOL" is? 

Actually, it's very difficult to explain briefly... The Japanese culture's maturation process is not about adding elements but about eliminating unnecessary ones. Most countries create culture by adding elements together. That's a big difference. English gardens are beautiful, with lots of greenery and seasonal flowers in bloom. But Japanese dry landscape gardens are the exact opposite. Not many people can find beauty in dry landscape gardens. However, most Japanese people have a sense of love and beauty for these bare, lonely gardens. If I were to express that feeling in words, it would be as follows: "Nothingness, but there is something in that nothingness." This sense is one of the Japanese COOL, I think. 

You have created a new genre of performance art called Geibu. What prompted you to create Geibu and what are its characteristics and sources of inspiration? 

When I was younger I was so much into Hip Hop that I completely lost my original identity. When I woke up from that false spell, I started searched for my identity. That is what led me to the creation of "Geibu". Karate punches and boxing punches are completely different methods. The core difference lays in the way you use your hips. Geibu is a style that incorporates the way you use hips in karate into a performance. If you master this, you can still move great, even when you're older, like Karate Master. There is an interesting story behind a Karate proverb. In training , "At 40 and 50 you are still a kid. You can finally get it at age 60.". This means that what is important in Karate is not muscles or physical strength, but how you use your body. 

You've also developed a new performance style called "Projection Live", which synchronises live dance and projected images, and we assume you'll be using this style in The Life of HOKUSAI as well. What do you think is most unique about Hokusai's art? How do you approach him and his art and how do you reveal this approach in your show? 

Hokusai's technique for controlling sumi(Japanese black ink) is truly remarkable. He can use a brush to place sumi in various shapes on paper. When he moves the brush at a high position, the sumi lines become thin, and when the position is low, the lines become thick. The speed at which the brush moves also affects the sumi. When the brush is moving, it can draw lines of consistent thickness, but when the movement stops, the sumi contained in the brush flows onto the paper, creating a significant accent. Hokusai acquired the skill to masterfully control sumi through great effort. The lines drawn with this technique are called "Hokusai lines". However, ordinary people do not understand the difficulty of controlling sumi, so only those who appreciate paintings can understand the greatness of Hokusai lines. Therefore, we expressed how much effort Hokusai put into acquiring this skill in a projection live performance. Hokusai truly struggles with sumi. He eventually masters it as if it were a part of his body. In the end, it is as if the sumi flows into his body like his blood. Projection live was indispensable to deliver this tension. Furthermore, being a non-verbal performance, it helps communicating in a direct way with the audience. 

The Istanbul audience will be meeting you and one of your pieces for the first time. Is there anything special you would like to tell the Istanbul audience before they experience The Life of HOKUSAI? 

To me, being in The Life of Hokusai is not only playing a role. I read all the literature about Hokusai when I was making this work. Hokusai's life, full of struggles, was exactly like mine. He and I shared the same habits in daily life, the same tastes in food. We both had difficulty interacting with people and were considered eccentrics by those around us. However, fortunately, both he and I had the means to shine and be recognized by others. That was art. That is why we were able to pour all our energy into that one thing. In many ways, Hokusai and I are connected. At some point, I could no longer distinguish whether I was Hokusai or Katsumi Sakakura. In public, I found myself talking about a Hokusai's painting using the first person, as if I did it. Amidst the fear of losing my sense of self, I also felt a sense of joy. The stage performance The Life of HOKUSAI tells the story of the genius artist Hokusai, but it is also the story of a 60-year-old Japanese artist named Katsumi Sakakura. I'd love people to expect a work telling how art helped the encounter of two men, belonging to two different eras.

[The Turkish version of this interview has been published on unlimited.]